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Appeal for Unbanning

Discussion in 'Ban Appeals Archive' started by 1nstantkill, Aug 28, 2012.

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  1. 1nstantkill

    1nstantkill Settling in Altera

    Moderators and Admins,

    Thank you in advance for taking the time to consider this appeal.
    I am writing this appeal because I feel that I have been wrongly punished by a grey area in the common law.
    The reason I was banned was for macroing, which I will admit is true in order to try and raise my repair skill beyond the atrociously long 50 level spread to repairing stone.

    However, in no way does macroing violate the clause in the common law, "Citizens must not seek to exploit game bugs, lag, redstone circuits, mob spawners or client/server modifications in any way that gives them or someone else an unfair advantage."

    My reasons are as follows:

    1) Macroing is not an exploit of any game bugs, lag, redstone circuits, or mob spawners, and is not a client/server modification. The macro was created using my own in-game input, and involved no redstone circuits, mob spawners, or anything exploitative of the game or server. Say what you will about my methodology, but I destroyed my weapon with the same key inputs others would in game, and repaired it all the same. It is also not on the same level as "cobblestone generators" as mentioned in the common law. Whereas those create resources, nothing about my methodology differed from what someone would do in game to level repair.

    2) Leveling repair in this way does not give me an unfair advantage. If anything, I was going to use the skill to benefit others by offering my services, but that is not really what is of concern here. Any advantage I gain is firstly, passive (as in not pvp related), and secondly, is arguably fairly earned through the time I needed to give up playing to level the skill, not to mention the hours of bug testing and just watching it flub up due to server lag or bad coding. For at least 90% of the time, I was monitoring my macro, which firstly means I can't do something else in the server, and secondly, can't even use my computer! Sloppy coding is by no means an excuse, but I just want to say that my actions were a clear investment on my part, and don't demonstrate any attempt to be lazy or exploitative. Rather, like anyone who finds a good way of doing something, I was being efficient with the limited time and attention span I have to leveling an arguably impossible skill (but that's another story).

    I am truly sorry that Roopot, and any other admins involved, felt that it was a violation of the common law, but as I stated, macroing does not violate the common law, at least as written.

    I do, however, acknowledge the counter arguments, which I will answer in advance:

    Perhaps macroing to level repair is similar enough to someone farming spawners that it constitutes as an exploit?

    Unlike leveling your swordsmanship, which offers pvp advantages as well as enchanting experience, repair can only be leveled in one way and to one end... breaking tools so that you can restore them. Farming a spawner is to me at least, clearly immoral and is an in-game shortcut to someone else's hard work legitimately finding and killings mobs. However, to level repair, there is no shortcuts, tools must be broken through overuse and the appropriate materials used to repair it. If it is expected that all tools used for repair be broken down through legitimate use for farming materials, then mcmmo should not allow experience to be gained by any other means. It is the same as if someone was cutting down trees in a tree farm vs the wild. I simply narrowed down how the game handles experience and resource collection, and dedicated my time to the task. Leaving something to grow while you are away doing something else? Sounds a lot like what I tried to do. In no way did my actions find any in-game shortcut that violates the common law, specifically because no time was circumvented or materials shorted. Everything that was saved resides in the cartilage of my fingers, the cornea of my eye, and the neurons in my head, and as such, I do not feel it necessary to punish someone for conserving their health or sanity.

    Lastly, some food for thought.

    My character doesn't exist without me around? Is he not allowed to level up his repair in his free time? So what if he needs a little direction?

    I will, however, apologize for my actions as it was no intent of mine to give myself any perceivable advantage or to knowingly break any server rules. I also apologize with the promise of never macroing again on the server. I can't say it was wrong to try and find a better way of doing something, but it is wrong to continuing doing something if at least one other person feels that it is unjust. It also helps that the people with the concern are also in charge, and I respect your wishes.
  2. Legion

    Legion No Gods, No Masters. Retired Staff

    Character Name:
    Lord Draiden
    Race:
    Human
    In-game Town/City:
    Wintermourne
    House:
    Draiden
    By macroing, you wrote a program ( or took one) to level up your repair skill whilst you were away from keyboard doing other things?
  3. 1nstantkill

    1nstantkill Settling in Altera

    I wrote my own yesterday. Took nearly all day, and tbh I sat and watched it because it was so buggy, started suffocating many times (check the logs). I was at research this morning and hoped to get a few levels in so that I could get to 50 and therefore actually repair stone. Tbh wood is not a very useful tool and stone would be much better to use so that I could actually go out and mine and bring back my damaged picks to be repaired by hand (no macro that is).
  4. Legion

    Legion No Gods, No Masters. Retired Staff

    Character Name:
    Lord Draiden
    Race:
    Human
    In-game Town/City:
    Wintermourne
    House:
    Draiden
    Yea, your banned permanently, good try.
    This is one of those "common sense" things that the we cant believe we have to spell out for people sometimes.
    This is CLEARLY, absolutely, irrefutably cheating.
    Ban stands.
    (unless roopot decides otherwise, which i highly doubt)
    • Like Like x 2
  5. 1nstantkill

    1nstantkill Settling in Altera

    Well, morals are morals. I do not consider it cheating because that implies there was a more moral way of doing something. Leveling repair can ONLY be done in one way, which is the way I did it. Whether that way is at the keyboard the whole time or not, should not matter. I would suggest perhaps adding this to your common law, because it is not common sense when you are technologically oriented. If you asked someone on the street if you could have something done for you without you being there, they would probably consider that cheating. But if you said that that you got a robot to do the job for you, they would probably ask if you got a promotion.
  6. abbeyvie

    abbeyvie Lord of Altera

    Character Name:
    Nimah Ankar
    Alt Name:
    DemonicFowl
    Race:
    Human
    Umm.. Well you're appeal is long, but you kept proving reasons why your cheating was okay.. Then you admit it was wrong and you're sorry? Your appeal bi-polar.. :confused:
    • Like Like x 3
  7. Legion

    Legion No Gods, No Masters. Retired Staff

    Character Name:
    Lord Draiden
    Race:
    Human
    In-game Town/City:
    Wintermourne
    House:
    Draiden
    Well instant kill you are considering this as if its work. Its not, its a game. A macro program is something no one else ( mostly) will have, therefore making it an unfair advantage.

    I dont feel the need to explain it to you however.
    • Like Like x 3
  8. 1nstantkill

    1nstantkill Settling in Altera

    Um, I never said it was cheating. I reasons explain why it isn't cheating and how it is exactly what someone would really do in game. No shortcuts was the key. The fact that you read it as my attempt to justify cheating is, in my opinion, because you just don't agree with me. It common for people to not even consider the other side of the argument because it is so against their own way of thinking. My philosophy that macroing is not cheating is an example of this, and I'm sorry that my reasoning didn't make sense to you. It's ok though, I'll miss the server, but I just hope you can see where I am coming from when I say that I'm sorry.
  9. 1nstantkill

    1nstantkill Settling in Altera

    And at Legion, my character needs to have work, I do not. That's why I need a macro. To give my character work while I can just play for the fun. Leveling repair isn't fun at first, but I wanted it higher because I wanted to find a niche role for myself in game. I'm sorry if I can't have fun the same way you do and it is not really a fair advantage that I have what someone does not. Anyone that levels repair without a macro has something I don't, extreme patience. In all honesty though, I feel that this is just a philosophical battle that has no end. Is it ok for a machine to do a person's work for them? We let machines run our everyday life. Hollowworld and altera all run on automated programs that make your life easier and more manageable. Without hawkeye, my actions would go unnoticed and you would not be able to do your job as a moderator. Likewise, without my macro, I feel as though it would be overwhelming to do my job, or what I made my job in leveling repair.
  10. madyson0915

    madyson0915 Lord of Altera

    I called roopot to you while you were digging that dirt. You were unresponsive.
    Other people would have to manually dig out the dirt. You cheated.
  11. Legion

    Legion No Gods, No Masters. Retired Staff

    Character Name:
    Lord Draiden
    Race:
    Human
    In-game Town/City:
    Wintermourne
    House:
    Draiden
    You dont understand, the repair skill has rewards that are based on the amount of work you are willing to do. It has such great rewards because it takes a long time to get them, and lots of hard work.
    You took a shortcut, bypassed the part where you have to work for your reward, and thats why its cheating.
    Its exactly the same as X-raying. just instead of diamonds you want levels.
    • Like Like x 1
  12. 1nstantkill

    1nstantkill Settling in Altera

    I edited my response above for a little more philosophical input.


    Anyway not going to argue with how much "work" you have to put into doing something. If you consider it cheating that I get to do less manual work because I put upfront more intellectual work that's fine. I did not x-ray which was one of the things CLEARLY stated, so I just feel like you need to update your common law.

    The only way I see to level repair is to just manually break your own weapons and do what I was doing, which is not really the original intent of the skill anyway. I'd think a little bit about revising the repair skill if possible.

    Anyways for your amusement for humoring me, here's a clip from one of my favorite old movies that's relevant.



    And merlin doesn't use black magic...
    • Like Like x 1
  13. Legion

    Legion No Gods, No Masters. Retired Staff

    Character Name:
    Lord Draiden
    Race:
    Human
    In-game Town/City:
    Wintermourne
    House:
    Draiden
    You dont understand that this isnt fair for others who dont have this option, and since you are smart enough to write your own macro i have to believe that you have the sense to realize this isnt what we intended to happen.
    Therefore my only conclusions is that you are not particularly considerate of others, and that you thought you could get away with it because you could play dumb and hope to exploit something that wasnt specifically listed.

    Goodbye.
    • Like Like x 5
  14. Kruziik

    Kruziik <3 Hollow World

    http://hollowworld.wikia.com/wiki/Server_Rules

    Rule flagrantly broken, just as MMOs ban people for macroing I don't see why it should be considered OK to do it on what is an MMO MC server. I doubt anyone wants a server full of macro and bot users, if we wanted that we'd be playing World of Warcraft. Totally back Legion 100% on this, he's been far more considerate than he needed to be.
    • Like Like x 2
  15. bodejodel

    bodejodel Reaching for the Heavens Retired Staff

    Character Name:
    Seigh Caelder Talon
    In-game Town/City:
    Heaven's Reach
    House:
    Hawklight
    If the creator of an x-ray mod spent days programming his mod, you say it would be ok for him to x-ray an X amount of diamonds just to get a headstart?
    • Like Like x 7
  16. roopot

    roopot The Great Leper Staff Member

    Character Name:
    Robert, Duke of Skadi
    Alt Name:
    Anasanserine, catraptio
    Race:
    Human


    the video evidence
    • Like Like x 4
  17. madyson0915

    madyson0915 Lord of Altera

    Fully denied? Moving.
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