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Alignment issues
- Thread starter Spear
- Start date
Well, you could claim it was good - even genuinely believe it. You would just be horribly, horribly wrong.
rauyran
Burner of Worlds
Pretty simplistic world view that avoids arguments about the "greater good". QG is acting for the greater good - if she doesn't act then all life will be wiped out. In your definition, doing nothing and letting all life go extinct would be classed as good.
That sounds neutral to me. Good could be defined as an active stance to make the greatest improvement for the greatest amount of life.
(do I need to say that these aren't necessarily my IRL beliefs?)
I have to disagree with you...
Letting all life go extinct? Since when are we fighting another, greater evil then Sarah Grief? I highly doubt there's someone or something with the capabilities of annihilating all life out there. If you mean it in a more ''psychological'' way in which humanity would destroy the world, this seems extremely unprobable, given the obvious fact that since we are in front of a ''Technological wall'' which prevents us from researching deeper into energies and using potentially ''harmful'' methods and substances (no need to tell you what i'm referring to...) and also keeps us in a medieval state where we practically don't alter anything.
Now, if you're talking about magic, well, i don't see a lot of extremely dangerous, world-annihilating magical experiments going on... I doubt a couple of fireballs or a flying town made of full donuts (hai nael :3) will change anything.
rauyran
Burner of Worlds
I thought the tech lock was created by the immortal kings and enforced by grief. From the lore:
and
pyrocide
The Mogul of Cromarcky
Going into a deep discussion over what kind of world view a character ascribes to goes far and away from the simplistic Alignment Table. As philosophers we could debate the greater good and ends justifying means ect ect...
As far as a simple "good v evil, law v chaos" table goes, Grief is obviously Chaotic Evil. Whether she has noble intentions or not, she wields the powers of the "chaos of the nether" to commit genocide. There really isn't a debate here.
Like I said, we could delve deep into the inner meaning of Grief and her role, debate philosophically on all of these points, and come up with lots of grey areas and possibilities. But in the end, we all know Grief was put in the lore to 1) give justification to the tech lock 2) give justification to swapping out old maps and 3) to give a universal "bad guy" for the server to rally against for fun events.
finally, as a separate point, the logic behind Grief's actions, and her existence as a whole, is terrible at best. Would love a retcon to fix it but I bet it's not going to happen, so meh.
As far as a simple "good v evil, law v chaos" table goes, Grief is obviously Chaotic Evil. Whether she has noble intentions or not, she wields the powers of the "chaos of the nether" to commit genocide. There really isn't a debate here.
Like I said, we could delve deep into the inner meaning of Grief and her role, debate philosophically on all of these points, and come up with lots of grey areas and possibilities. But in the end, we all know Grief was put in the lore to 1) give justification to the tech lock 2) give justification to swapping out old maps and 3) to give a universal "bad guy" for the server to rally against for fun events.
finally, as a separate point, the logic behind Grief's actions, and her existence as a whole, is terrible at best. Would love a retcon to fix it but I bet it's not going to happen, so meh.
rauyran
Burner of Worlds
The immortal kings are chaotic evil by that definition since they came up with the idea. Grief is just holding them to their word.
pyrocide
The Mogul of Cromarcky
I wouldn't argue against that statement. The chaotic side maybe, but any group of people that decide genocide, "plagues, and famines" are all acceptable means of controlling a population are most certainly evil.
If this statement contradicts other lore concerning the immortal kings, which I'm almost certain it does, I point back to my statement of the logic behind this bit of lore being terrible and my wish to see it retcon'ed.
If this statement contradicts other lore concerning the immortal kings, which I'm almost certain it does, I point back to my statement of the logic behind this bit of lore being terrible and my wish to see it retcon'ed.
Naelwyn
Non sum qualis eram
The last time King Cherbert graced Altera with his presence, he blew up Daggerfall~
Make of Alignments what you will~
(Trololololo.)
Personally, i consider that most immortal kings and some gods are chaotic/neutral evil (even if they aren't necessarily bad persons).
Why?
Well because they have the power and the will to act without anyone's consent and against everyone's will. While sitting on their godly thrones, gods and immortals take decisions who can maybe help some, but against the greater needs of others. They say and follow what grief said, which is basically: ''Don't allow them to progress technologically, or they will become able to wield the power of Gods and question our authority.'' I think that while Gods and immortal may think they are acting for the greater good, they may in fact do what seems better to them for us, and without giving us (da lowly mortals) any autonomy in what seems better for our world. Why, you say again?
I would go much deeper and said that some of the Gods/immortals fear what we could become if we were to learn the mysteries of science. Since, according to the lore, they stopped us from advancing, I think that doing so, even for a somewhat ''good'' reason (I still don't think we will destroy eachother with stars n stuff
) show that they aren't ''Good'' but rather ''Chaotic Neutral/Neutral Neutral'' or even maybe ''Neutral Evil''.
Why?
Well because they have the power and the will to act without anyone's consent and against everyone's will. While sitting on their godly thrones, gods and immortals take decisions who can maybe help some, but against the greater needs of others. They say and follow what grief said, which is basically: ''Don't allow them to progress technologically, or they will become able to wield the power of Gods and question our authority.'' I think that while Gods and immortal may think they are acting for the greater good, they may in fact do what seems better to them for us, and without giving us (da lowly mortals) any autonomy in what seems better for our world. Why, you say again?
I would go much deeper and said that some of the Gods/immortals fear what we could become if we were to learn the mysteries of science. Since, according to the lore, they stopped us from advancing, I think that doing so, even for a somewhat ''good'' reason (I still don't think we will destroy eachother with stars n stuff
) show that they aren't ''Good'' but rather ''Chaotic Neutral/Neutral Neutral'' or even maybe ''Neutral Evil''.
C
Cubey
Guest
Cherbert told me he was cursed by reading "cursed book" something... he must be TROLL!
U
unnamed
Guest
Oooh... I hear.. everyone are.. talking... about me...? I feel... so.. special...
*hasn't been following this thread since before pyrocide crashed it*
Point of thread was to make people aware that there's more than one way to play an evil character or a good character In hollow world, Seeing as at least 2 people have said they're going to be making changes to their characters or writing new ones differently I call it a 100% success regardless of whatever's been said since as frankly I can't be bothered to read it all.
Point of thread was to make people aware that there's more than one way to play an evil character or a good character In hollow world, Seeing as at least 2 people have said they're going to be making changes to their characters or writing new ones differently I call it a 100% success regardless of whatever's been said since as frankly I can't be bothered to read it all.
pyrocide
The Mogul of Cromarcky
I've re-written this post about four times now, trying to phrase this as politely as I can.
The passive-aggressive dismissal of my post is not appreciated.
Your assessment of alignment is wrong, and in fact was confusing people as evidenced by this thread. The people that were going to make changes to their character pages were doing so under incorrect information about how the alignment system works.
I simply disagreed with your definitions, and substituted correct ones.
This thread is still sticky'd and still contains false information on the original post that will confuse more players if not changed or taken down.
Thank you for your understanding, and I hope our relations improve in the future.
The passive-aggressive dismissal of my post is not appreciated.
Your assessment of alignment is wrong, and in fact was confusing people as evidenced by this thread. The people that were going to make changes to their character pages were doing so under incorrect information about how the alignment system works.
I simply disagreed with your definitions, and substituted correct ones.
This thread is still sticky'd and still contains false information on the original post that will confuse more players if not changed or taken down.
Thank you for your understanding, and I hope our relations improve in the future.
No its my bad sorry been having an odd night, was in a bad mood from finding out I apparently get nothing from the broken moon thing whilst you and blarg do which is probably why I was (for lack of a better phrase) being an ass.
Have since however made a few changes to my plans on the server so I don't feel so much like I've just been blown off track completely, was feeling fairly grim about the whole church thing and even more so when I found out it stops me from getting anything but having sorted things out now I feel its fair enough. Again sorry you are right it was only a rough idea I had the other day as I was sick of every villain on the server deciding they had to be enemies with the church as well as the crown and so on, just wanted people to better define between the factions.
Have since however made a few changes to my plans on the server so I don't feel so much like I've just been blown off track completely, was feeling fairly grim about the whole church thing and even more so when I found out it stops me from getting anything but having sorted things out now I feel its fair enough. Again sorry you are right it was only a rough idea I had the other day as I was sick of every villain on the server deciding they had to be enemies with the church as well as the crown and so on, just wanted people to better define between the factions.
pyrocide
The Mogul of Cromarcky
I'll be honest I figured that was about to head down a dark path... I appreciate your candor. That is a totally understandable situation and I would be stressed as well had I been in your place. Posting Willy Wonka probably didn't help things, though it was my intention to lighten the mood, and I didn't actually know that the position meant that much to you.
As a side note, hit me up with a pm and let's discuss the church and what all we can do with that. I have some ideas I'd like to discuss with you that you might like.
As a side note, hit me up with a pm and let's discuss the church and what all we can do with that. I have some ideas I'd like to discuss with you that you might like.
