Metagaming

[Teeke]

The points I made are truly examples of metagaming.
It is playing the game OUTSIDE of the game ((i lost the game))

Everything that is IC keep it IC or else you are indeed participating in the metagame.

If I were getting nitpicky I would point out checking out someone's profile is a form of meta.
Frankly BECAUSE of this form of metagame i actually was keeping a profile for one of my characters in pm.



To be fair I consider myself something of an extremist when it comes to viewing what constitutes metagaming, but many many people - actually everyone, metagames.
Despite my best efforts, even I play the metagame on occasion.

 

[Tybalt]

Just like how Columbus accidentally founded a new continent, eh? Aye, it is odd when such things happen, I can agree there. However, even I must admit my own inadequacy, I've done stupid things that ended up working after mishearing or interpreting someone.

Aye, but Columbus accidentally discovered something that he wasn't looking for.
But person B accidentally discovered what he was exactly looking for by mishearing the exact words Person A said. Also ignored the fact that Person A stays in the south generally.

 

[Tybalt]

... Well I didn't expect this thread to turn into a discussion of the metamap.

Though that does seem to be a bit of a concern, it wasn't what i had in mind when discussing metagaming.




This was more along the lines of what I wanted to discuss. Subtler forms of metagaming. Things like this:

Itachi, a wanted criminal, wears a disguise, but for some reason, everyone in the general vicinity can identify him through a number of ridiculous means (when really, the players read his name)

Or

Itachi is a nobleman who secretly follows a heretical god, but as soon as this is revealed on his forum profile, everyone suddenly starts "randomly" asking him about the gods, or finding him suspicious. (When really, the only reason everyone's suspicious is because they read his profile)

Or

Itachi the wanted criminal is hiding in the woods. Suddenly, like five people are having a jaunty stroll in those same woods, and find him by sheer "coincidence"

That's some serious metagaming. That ruins the story, makes villains too easily defeated, makes it incredibly hard for characters to keep secrets, and as a result, players who want to keep IC secrets might go to ridiculous, paranoid lengths in order to avoid being the victim of metagaming.

To continue using Itachi as an example, Itachi's player decides to quote-on-quote "kill off Itachi," and then starts playing as a "new character" named Roxas, who looks vaguely similar to Itachi. Roxas' profile is incredibly vague.

Which I think is really sad, because now people who play a character with a secret have three options:

A) deal with questioning every single person who metas out the secret, and have to pick apart all the excuses given them,
B) never let the other players in on the secret, essentially sacrificing the element of suspense for some piece of mind,
Or C), have the secret or the character be so irrelevant, nobody bothers to meta it.

Which, I mean, can't we trust the general community to not metagame? Do we really have to use /dynmap hide and write vague character profiles, just to prevent other people from meta-ing to the point that a character is made unplayable?

I mean, people complain about the lack of villains, but then an evil character can never actually have enough power to do anything, because everyone knows they're a villain, and nobody trusts them.

All my agree.

My character went into a dang good cover. Disguise was as perfect as one can possibly get to in this age and time.

Even tho he had participated in daily activities within the group of people he infiltrated, for days... People kept prodding into his personal business and kept having an unneeded watch and suspicion over him.

Honestly, after fooling the people, they should have treated him just like any other citizen who joined the town. Since then a couple of people have joined said town, and there was not a single shred of suspicion of them. Even tho, my character constantly had to worry about that after joining... When in reality it's just as if a new person would have joined the town. Quite irritating and one if the reasons I had My character pull out from undercover and went home....

 

[Somnastra]

IF YOU ARE DISAGREEING WITH THIS PLEASE POST A RESPONSE


There are multiple forms of metagaming that I've noticed. I'll list them in order of common occurrence.

1) Arranging an RP meet up through OOC means.
2) Using OOC information in an IC way.
3) Using the map to figure out where RP might be occurring. ((same as #2 but deserves its own mention))
4) Through purely OOC means ( OOC building, OOC discussion, etc ) causing something IC to happen.
5) Inviting someone to join you someplace OOC but then turning it into an IC event.
6) Harassing someone OOC because of something they have done IC.
7) Sharing money between accounts/characters.


There are more, I might come back and add to this list.

From a Staff perspective.

The only true metagaming that's on this list are 2 and 3. 5 is just rude (but people have the option to scoot away if that happens~) and is in a different class than metagaming. 6 is harassment, and not keeping IC/OOC separate.

1 and 4 become metagaming if there is no legitimate justifcation for behavior/circumstances.

 

[Somnastra]

Now, let's clear something up, folks.

If you are having a hard time with people metagaming stuff, and you absolutely cannot handle it with gentle nudges and polite conversation with the other person, that is what the moderation staff is here for. I do not want to have to learn that there is a "problem with metagaming" from a vague thread. I want you guys to come to me.

And if you have a ridiculous set of standards like @mucusBONES, understand that not all of what you consider metagaming is even remotely actionable. Like coordinating RP. People have RL, their own schedules, limited time, all that jazz- and this is a game.

 

[dogbew]

This seems like a mountain is being made out of this molehill of an issue. Meta is a tool to help encourage roleplay, and frankly has a bad reputation. Surely if you pop up at a private event which you found out about though ooc knowledge, it is a bad thing. If I see my buddies at a bar, and i show up, it is not.
In the event of bad meta, an admin should be consulted, and the issue will be resolved reasonably and fairly.

 

[Gaby]

Now, let's clear something up, folks.

If you are having a hard time with people metagaming stuff, and you absolutely cannot handle it with gentle nudges and polite conversation with the other person, that is what the moderation staff is here for. I do not want to have to learn that there is a "problem with metagaming" from a vague thread. I want you guys to come to me.

And if you have a ridiculous set of standards like @mucusBONES, understand that not all of what you consider metagaming is even remotely actionable. Like coordinating RP. People have RL, their own schedules, limited time, all that jazz- and this is a game.

thank you, Som, for clearing that up.
actually, the only recent really egregious example of metagaming was actually reported to staff fairly quickly.
I made this thread in order to make people more mindful of something which I saw as a recurring situation, with examples so minor, confronting people directly about it or reporting it to staff would be pathetically nitpicky and ultimately fruitless.

so uh...

this thread is actually me trying to make the community work together to devise ways to prevent the minor examples of metagaming that turn overwhelming when multiple people do it at the same time, so that staff would only need to be contacted on the most egregious examples.

this is vague. sorry. I'm trying to help.

 

[pyrocide]

this thread is actually me trying to make the community work together to devise ways to prevent ... metagaming

The community response should be:
1, realize when you or others are metagaming, as explained by Som's response to the previously made list.
2, inform said metagamer of their action, and ask to resolve said issue. (Do actually try this and don't immediately jump to the next point.)
3, if no player resolution can be found, contact staff. Have screenshots, witness testimony, and a great deal of patience in hand.

 

[Azur]

I don't understand this...what.

 

[dUMMY]

Metagaming: The resources available to us that can be used for metagaming are not the problem, the problem is the people that metagame/ people that don't fully understand when/how they are metagaming.

Take away the map and we will still have metagamers. Heck, we would have to disable nametags, remove all character profiles and much more if we think that the way to stop metagaming is to remove all possible exploits.

The solution, in my opinion, is to have responsible and educated players.

 

[Gaby]

Metagameing: The resources available to us that can be used for metagaming are not the problem, the problem is the people that metagame/ people that don't fully understand when/how they are metagaming.

Take away the map and we will still have metagamers. Heck, we would have to disable nametags, remove all character profiles and much more if we think that the way to stop metagaming is to remove all possible exploits.

The solution, in my opinion, is to have responsible and educated players.

thus, this thread.

 

[DraconDarknight]

Lets also not forget that a lot of things people know IC somehow make it into the rumors thread, which is usable in character

 

[Goldengem25]

Metagaming's gone a lot further than this for a long while, mainly with people breaking lore/character to follow OOC decisions. Though I'm pretty biased on this >_>