Lore & History FAQ

[Jstar]

I want to ask a question about some terms. We say things like Achilles Heel and Tendon, Stockholm Syndrome, Nuremberg Defense and some other terms that use names in the real world. So what would be the equivalents to these things in the Hollow World universe?

Stockholm Syndrome wasn't really talked about as a concept until the early seventies.
The Nuremburg Defense wouldn't have a name I expect, it'd probably simply come down to a person saying "I was just following orders".

Tendons I imagine would remain tendons for simplicity but I can't give you an answer to the Achilles Heel question.

 

[Naelwyn]

Not everything has an analogue. The English language itself is chock full of loanwords and stuff that has come up from a historical context. Adequately trying to come up with an alternate explanation for everything would be absolutely impossible.

For practical purposes, simply attempt to avoid anachronisms or Earthisms in phrasing as best you can. Even that's not something I expect everybody to pull off remotely close to consistently, and it's due to the primary language we use here.

 

[CyberChaosV2]

I want to ask a question about some terms. We say things like Achilles Heel and Tendon, Stockholm Syndrome, Nuremberg Defense and some other terms that use names in the real world. So what would be the equivalents to these things in the Hollow World universe?

The Beledrent effect
When a perfectly decent sized humanoid wishes to grow smaller

 

[Ced]

I want to ask a question about some terms. We say things like Achilles Heel and Tendon, Stockholm Syndrome, Nuremberg Defense and some other terms that use names in the real world. So what would be the equivalents to these things in the Hollow World universe?

Altera would have its own fables and myths of legendary characters. For the sake of fluidity Achilles can just be one of those figures; a story about a bloke who got shot in the foot and lost a duel.
Tendons have been around for a very long time, and Alteran physicians would know about them.
Stockholm Syndrome and Nuremberg Defense are both modern terms and so shouldn't be used, in the same way our characters shouldn't use terms like schizophrenia, speed of light, or say things like 'gnarly, dude'.

 

[Naelwyn]

Altera would have its own fables and myths of legendary characters. For the sake of fluidity Achilles can just be one of those figures; a story about a bloke who got shot in the foot and lost a duel.
Tendons have been around for a very long time, and Alteran physicians would know about them.
Stockholm Syndrome and Nuremberg Defense are both modern terms and so shouldn't be used, in the same way our characters shouldn't use terms like schizophrenia, speed of light, or say things like 'gnarly, dude'.

I disagree with this decision profusely because it makes a huge chunk of lore and speech ambiguous.

Who named their kid /Achilles/ in the current cultural mix of Altera? When did it happen? There's not, to my knowledge, been anyone attempting something Greek inspired.
Precedent on this opens a huge can of worms I am relentlessly happy to demonstrate.

Edit 1: All one has to do is start bringing Earth-specific speech in and it starts retroactively conjuring history. Examples of this are /immeasurable/ in English.

Are you answering yourself or after a consultation with your entire lore team?

I personally think you should all have a little chat about the potential negative impacts to your consistency before you pop this can of worms.

 

[Blorbis83]

I disagree with this decision profusely because it makes a huge chunk of lore and speech ambiguous.

Who named their kid /Achilles/ in the current cultural mix of Altera? When did it happen? There's not, to my knowledge, been anyone attempting something Greek inspired.
Precedent on this opens a huge can of worms I am relentlessly happy to demonstrate.

Edit 1: All one has to do is start bringing Earth-specific speech in and it starts retroactively conjuring history. Examples of this are /immeasurable/ in English.

Are you answering yourself or after a consultation with your entire lore team?

I personally think you should all have a little chat about the potential negative impacts to your consistency before you pop this can of worms.

I don't think it's nearly as drastic as you claim...it's just a few sayings..

 

[Jazzper]

Who named their kid /Achilles/ in the current cultural mix of Altera?

With all due respect, I think that there's plenty of IC cultures that could have someone named Achilles in them.
Savages, Sooleran, Norvagen, Lucan, Earthspawn maybe?
Doesn't have to be Greek-inspired to have a name like Achilles, in my opinion.

I don't think it's nearly as drastic as you claim...it's just a few sayings..

And like Thomas said, it's just a few sayings.
It's not like someone just discovered Greek Fire.

 

[Immerael]

There was an attempted Greek culture on the last map but it never took off or really got anywhere. I forgot who but there intent was to make a Greek place but I don't remember any actual RP ever happening.

Edit: Found it http://hollowworld.co.uk/threads/project-minovia.33404/

Looks like it did get some action.

 

[Jazzper]

There was an attempted Greek culture on the last map but it never took off or really got anywhere. I forgot who but there intent was to make a Greek place but I don't remember any actual RP ever happening.

And I do believe there is a Greek/Roman-inspired guy or two about but I can't seem to find the lad.

 

[MRPolo13]

That's one hell of a nonissue to be crying about. Worldbuilding is done not through giant things but through the small things, such as mannerisms and sayings. And because those were always expected to be made by the community that was never given any direction on how to approach it, there are no sayings or mannerisms that are universal in Altera, maybe aside stuff about Queen Grief.

 

[Jazzper]

Five actually
Look around the forums for Asrakosian culture- we need help growing it!
(I'm so sorry for the shameless self-promotion, please don't hurt me)

You were totally not the guy with the culture I was talking about
Yeah

 

[Ced]

I disagree with this decision profusely because it makes a huge chunk of lore and speech ambiguous.

Who named their kid /Achilles/ in the current cultural mix of Altera? When did it happen? There's not, to my knowledge, been anyone attempting something Greek inspired.
Precedent on this opens a huge can of worms I am relentlessly happy to demonstrate.

Edit 1: All one has to do is start bringing Earth-specific speech in and it starts retroactively conjuring history. Examples of this are /immeasurable/ in English.

Are you answering yourself or after a consultation with your entire lore team?

I personally think you should all have a little chat about the potential negative impacts to your consistency before you pop this can of worms.

I'm pretty sure there's been at least 2 attempts at a greco-roman inspired towns, and I have vague memories of more in the early days. We have a very old, famous character called Rex, and I'm sure that with the hundreds of active characters throughout the years there has been such a wide variety of mish-mashed culture names that somewhere, more greco-roman names have been used.

Arcturus (a Latin name; they also had legions, unless I'm mistaken) used the French language, and Anhald uses German. Most of us use English, which is a great granddaughter language of Latin anyway, so having a story about a bloke named Achilles is no long stretch.

It's fair to say that the common stance for real-world folk tales and myths is that there is a comparable if not identical version for Hollow World. There's no need to invent some ancient Alteran who was invulnerable everywhere but his right arm and call it "Generic-GoT-name's elbow" for the sake of conveying the meaning behind the phrase.

 

[Naelwyn]

Congratulations. It took you guys exactly one question of contention to stop acting like a lore /team/ or to demonstrate any kind of teamwork - it's now just whomever wants to make decisions making them.

Sufficiently-Greek Cultural note - redacted.

It's fair to say that the common stance for real-world folk tales and myths is that there is a comparable if not identical version for Hollow World. There's no need to invent some ancient Alteran who was invulnerable everywhere but his right arm and call it "Generic-GoT-name's elbow" for the sake of conveying the meaning behind the phrase.

My point is that it's not going to always be fair to say that, and more the point, saying that means giving up on developing unique culture and lore.

Ala:

That's one hell of a nonissue to be crying about. Worldbuilding is done not through giant things but through the small things, such as mannerisms and sayings. And because those were always expected to be made by the community that was never given any direction on how to approach it, there are no sayings or mannerisms that are universal in Altera, maybe aside stuff about Queen Grief.

(1: Take the chip off your shoulder whenever you talk about lore, Polo. I've not been running it for at least as long a timeframe as I had been, so stop trying to lay every single decision you disagree with on me. It makes it hard to treat anything you say as serious because of how heavily biased you come off.)

2: Sayings or cultural phrases or stories developed as part of roleplay and culture development are what help make actually interesting cultures.

It's why the Nakam were liked, it's why the Norvagen felt more realistic. Saying "It's fair and common" means giving up on having as fleshed out cultures, period.

Unique expressions of language add feeling and depth to the world. The most obvious and well done example of this is the collected works Tolkien, a linguist, who crafted a world to craft his languages.

 

[Auriel]

"attempting something Greek inspired. Precedent on this opens a huge can of worms I am relentlessly happy to demonstrate."
Naelwyn

RexJen @Myself

 

[Naelwyn]

"attempting something Greek inspired. Precedent on this opens a huge can of worms I am relentlessly happy to demonstrate."
Naelwyn

RexJen @Myself

Are you going to actually make a point or just fail to use the quote tool?

It's two distinct sentences. The ugly can of worms precedent still stands.

 

[Old-Seadog]

I kind of regret asking the question. I did mean for these harsh comments to be published.

 

[Immerael]

I kind of regret asking the question. I did mean for these harsh comments to be published.

This is Hollowworlds wonderful community at its finest. Not your fault bro.

 

[Blorbis83]

I truly think this kind of salt is not required nor is it wanted. If you do not like people's lore, do not participate in it or take it up with the staff. A Greek/Byzantine/Imperial Roman/What-have-you culture/name/etc is not going to harm the server and will most likely immersify it. I'm not saying this as someone who helped create a culture but as someone who genuinely thinks ridiculing others ideas like this is wrong- especially when it begins to question the lore team when they haven't done anything to deserve it. This started off with a simple name issue and has now flung itself into dangerous territory- I propose we end this topic before further salt comes out from anyone.

PS Most European names/words are Latin/Greek-derived so, you can't escape > : )

 

[Ced]

Congratulations. It took you guys exactly one question of contention to stop acting like a lore /team/ or to demonstrate any kind of teamwork - it's now just whomever wants to make decisions making them.

Sufficiently-Greek Cultural note - redacted.

My point is that it's not going to always be fair to say that, and more the point, saying that means giving up on developing unique culture and lore.

There's no need to bite. None of us are interested in passing your tests or trying to live up to your standards - we talk about the topic, come to a majority agreement, and one of us posts it. The can of worms has been open for four years and they're all still wriggling around in there - it is a non-issue. I'm disinclined to argue with you as laboriously as this over something that the community has been doing for years with negligible negative effect. You can continue to post here about it of course, and other lore team members can take up the discussion, but most of us are currently unconvinced by your argument.

 

[Auriel]

Meanwhile, far-eastern cultures. C: